Even at their best in recent decades, Celtic have struggled awfully to win European games on the road. Right now, that looks way beyond them. Winning at home is too much for them these days, too.
So, yes, there are enough points on offer for Celtic to fight their way out of their Europa League dungeon and into the play-off, but in their current state it's more a philosophical thought than an attainable reality.
If you have lost three out of three, have scored three goals and have conceded nine, then banging on about points you might win down the line is an exercise in wishful thinking.
In the here and now, Celtic's standards are plummeting. That's on everybody.
It's on O'Neill and his players, though it's easy to have some sympathy for the manager when he not only has to field questions about the stuff he's responsible for but also come up with answers about stuff that he has no responsibility for - the ongoing circus that is Celtic's relationship with large elements of their own support.
And the blame is also, in greater part, on a board who are happy to have O'Neill and - when he's not around - Shaun Maloney, talking about the disconnect between fans and club, as was the case on Wednesday.
No chief executive, no chairman, no major shareholder and no major shareholder's son are anywhere to be seen when those issues are raised at news conferences. Just a manager or an assistant who, let's face it, have a few other things on their mind.
Just after the television coverage ended on Thursday there was a programme of highlights of big Celtic Park Champions League nights. Remember them?
Celtic beating the Manchester United of Paul Scholes, Ryan Giggs, Cristiano Ronaldo and Wayne Rooney; Celtic beating the AC Milan of Alessandro Nesta, Andrea Pirlo, Clarence Seedorf and Kaka; Celtic beating the Barcelona of Jordi Alba, Xavi, Iniesta and Lionel Messi.
A stadium literally shaking to its very foundations. Packed solid. Deafening. Unforgettable.
Look at it now. Empty seats and people leaving early. A game against the eighth best team in Spain, in a second-tier European competition - defeat and apathy. How they have fallen.
Of course, it might seem a little tiresome looking back at how things were 20 years ago, so let's not. Let's look at how things were in February last year.
Bayern Munich versus Celtic. Ninety-three minutes gone in the second leg in Germany and it's 2-2 on aggregate.
Bayern have started with a front four of Michael Olise, Jamal Musiala, Serge Gnabry and Harry Kane. Thomas Muller has replaced Musiala, Leroy Sane has come on for Gnabry, Kingsley Coman for Kane.
It took Bayern until the fourth minute of added time to see Celtic off. From there to here is some descent into European mediocrity and irrelevance.
O'Neill said that he "can't ask anything more" from his players. He can - and he must.
More must be asked of O'Neill and more - much, much more - must be asked of the board. Bringing in new players and a new manager is easily done, if they so wish. Whether it's the right players and the right manager is a different story, but it can be done in a heartbeat.
Changing a board, and a way of thinking, is a whole lot harder. There's little doubt all of these people want success for Celtic. They might get more of it domestically. They might win another league, another cup, maybe two. That is all highly possible, if not probable.
This question has been asked so many times now - and it's grim that it still has to be asked. What do Celtic stand for? Flat-track bullydom or something more, something more adventurous, something in keeping with the 'great European story' they so often talk about.
Because of the Lisbon Lions it is and always will be the greatest of all Scottish football stories. Nothing is ever likely to surpass it.
But there are other stories, in the present day, that are tiresome for Celtic folk, stories that are playing out now, almost on a loop. From Champions League to Europa League. What's next? Conference League. And after that?
Everyone in power at the club cannot look at that 36-team table and not feel an enormous sense of embarrassment. If they don't, they're really not in the right job.
The question is - do they have any kind of vision to make it better? Many observers of the club might see that as a rhetorical question.